The Boa-Pedal (Gatzen Pedal)

Pete, I'm all eyes, man!

Don,

I am really trying to be patient,
with my conclusions, giving them
every benefit of the doubt.

So far, my view of 'the fix' is that
it doesn't actually take care of
the core issue - which is that
the boards are too thin.

I can tell that what they are trying
to do is get more metal on the
board, through a larger Hold-Down
Clamp. That was something they
fell back on, I think, having tried
a thicker board and not liking the
response. Another thing that I
see them concerned about is
doing a total re-design. They
have already invested a lot in
this design and they are com-
mitted to it, in that way. That
is unfortunate, I think.

They seem to be considering the
idea of fully slotted boards, as I
put forward, last year. In other
words, not actually drilling holes
in the board but carrying out
the slot to the end of the board.
Mine are fully slotted. It's a
half-solution, I think. One of
the things I not like about it is
that when you are adjusting
the length of board to be ten-
sioned, it can slide out and
then getting it back in is a real
pain and if I were on the gig, I
would be REALLY pissed.

The issue I am having, with the
slave pedal is that it is making
a noise on the depress. They
are saying that it is unusual,
though I did experience, with
my original pedal. I have been
trying to work with it and have
not succeeded, so far. It may
end up being replaced. The
primary pedal is satisfactory.

For sure, the pedal has the
most incredibly flexible set-up,
excluding the short-board,
which I think is the key issue
in the bigger-picture solution,
though I realize it will be more
of a re-design, on their part,
should they go that route.

In my opinion, the solution is
going longboard, lengthening
it, allowing for the thicker,
stronger board (no breaking)
but because of the lengthen-
ing, allowing more flexability.
It will help the foot, too, al-
lowing for it to use the pedal
in more than a few ways.

I will be in touch, with more
information, as I get to it.

I am pretty decided, however,
on the basic attitude that this
pedal is not the pedal for
most drummers, only in that
it has too many adjustments
and some are just too entailed,
for quick changes.

Regards,

Check out this EBAY auction:

http://xrl.in/e01

It is worth that price, for sure.

Have at it.

Regards,

Wow, sorry to read that things aren't going as well as anticipated, Pete. Still looks like there's quie a bit of road to travel. Keep me posted.

In the meantime, what do you think of this concept? Top 4 links, click "Download Now" to the right.

http://hosted.filefront.com/DSlamm

Don.

Oh, yes, Don. I have seen
this, before. It was Thomas
Lang that I noticed using
this idea, with the Sonor
Giant-Step pedals.

I think it is cool for those
drummers, with these part-
icular setup needs. It is
something else to add the
idea of getting used to two
slaves' instead of one, as
we hear of slave problems
all the time. With this, it
is not an issue because
we are not always comp-
aring it to the primary
pedal. I like the idea of
a more consistently sim-
ilar response.

The 5K is a fine pedal. I
had one. It had nice action
and was solid. My main
thing is that it is not very
versatile. It is the way it
is and you have to love or
hate it.

Right now, I have my Trick
pedal on the kick and this
was after playing my Axis
Twins, over the weekend
and I thought they felt
good. I had wanted to
take the Boa's out. They
are not ready. Well, the
Trick Pedal feels so good!

I know that thing costs a
zillion dollars but man, I
cannot feel as good on
any other pedal!

I will be trying to get the
Boa's ready for this week-
end, hoping to get them
right. I have little hope;
the truth be known.

I will let you know.

Regards,

The noise is just unbelievable.
All the screws are tight and it
sounds like some kind of contact
is taking place, somewhere. I
had this same issue, with the
first pedal and I thought it was
just the board but it's more
than the board. This is where
the axial is housed. It's got to
go back, I am afraid.

I know this pedal would drive
most drummers up the wall
with this stuff.

I think I am pretty set in the
idea that I do not recommend it.


Regards,

Gosh,

I'm sorry, Pete. I know you put some exhaustive study and research into this unit and that you worked closely with DW/Pacific on this project. I wish things had worked out better. Hopefully in the future changes will be made that would make this a reality..... Hopefully!

Don.

I have a report on the Gatzen
Boa-Pedals, for you.

After a long interchange, with DW,
we have come to some real con-
clusions about the pedal, including
the design and some answers to
the problems that we experienced.

Recall that the footboards were
cracking. The cracks were very
fine, hardly detectable but there.
We concluded that the holes were
close enough that the strain, upon
tightening, caused the cracks.

After suggesting cutting the board,
I got back some to try out and
while the boards slid all the way
out, if you weren't careful on your
adjustment, the boards were not
cracking. Not only that, with the
cut, you got more board to use,
on the less-tension side, which
I have found to be a real plus.

They made the Hold-Down clamp
smaller for me, which also adds
to this range of flex and tension-
adjustment.

Now, the real lesson learned, I
believe has been related to the
Lock-tite, which is used on all
the bolts and Allens-screws. I
had a persistent play in the
beater assembly that drove me
crazy and I had sent the pedal
back a number of times and it
always came back the same.

This last time, I went for broke
and loosened these screws all
the way and then tightened
them, again but hard and what
I found was that I could go
further then we both had, in
the past and to the point where
the play disappeared.

Well, what I have here are a
set of twins that I love playing,
believe it, or not!

I will look to ammend this post,'
with photos.

Regards,

This is GREAT news. Pete... Keep us posted.

D.

I would be glad to talk about
the alternate setups, for this
pedal. It really is a versatile
cam and I have gone through
just about every adjustment.

Tell me what feels good or
what you want and I will tell
you how to get it out of it.

I will try and talk about some
of the alternatives, when I
get the next chance.

Start with the most radical
action, to get the idea of what
the pedal can do.

0. Adjust toe-clip forward, all
the way.

1. Drop Link-Receiver down, all
the way.

2. Now, slide foot-board for
variable flex, starting with the
most flex/slack.

3. Afterward, change the beater
angles very gradually, noting the
differences in feel and rebound.

This is the place to get your-
self on ITS map. You can do
other things that you would
do with any pedal, like making
sure your beater shaft is lower,
its housing, at the sweet-spot,
like your stick sits in your hand.

Most drummers do not realize
how much more action your
beater has down there. The
beater rods have fulcrum
issues, too.

It's a whole world, out there,
in terms of working with pedals
like these. They are worth your
time and effort.

Regards,

Hi, Pete,

My question is if I were to buy this pedal today, would I get it with all the new fixins, or do you have the first phase prototype?

D.

If you were to buy the pedal, today, Don
and wrote in, I am pretty sure they would
send you a cut off board.

Let me say that while the issue of the
cracked board was considerable, it was
not as important as the problems I was
experiencing, with the beater-play and
the Lock-tite. THAT turned out to be the
thing causing all that extra noise and
ruining the feel for me.

Now, that is gone and I am loving the
pedal. If you are thinking about it, let
me know because I want you to try it,
first, and with my adjustments. Out of
the box, it will not perform like mine.

Boa Single Pedal:

http://www.thediametrixletter.com/boa1.mp3

You let me know.

Regards,

Papa P,

I am in the market for another pedal and would really like to try something different and unique. But I really don't want to s spend S700.00 - $1200.00 for one. But I don't want a white elephant either. I bought the Axis on your recommendation. It was one of the best investments i've ever put my money on (Actually, Audrey, she got it for me for Xmas.). I found though that the machining of it is not really made for a bunch of put togethers and tear downs. If you don't hook things up just right, (double pedal linkage) you can actually strip and damage some of the fittings. So I use it sparingly when it comes to live performance.

I'd love to try the Boa, but I'd want one without all the issues... I don't know what you can hook up for me with those guys, Pete, but let me know what you can possibly work out. As far as your settings are concerned, I'm looking forward to checking them out for sure....

The clip is silky smoth bro! Footspeed that's only enhanced by your amazing control.

Let me know.

Thanks, P,

D.

Don,

Go to the store that has it and
ask them to let you take it out
and play it, whether it be the
twin or single. Just remember
that to go twin, you have to
buy a special twin. Two singles
will not make a double.

I will post a diagram, here, of
all the setting changes that I
would like you to make, which
will get you close to that place
you will want to operate.

Once you get to your setting,
you will not be moving things
around. We can even mark the
board, where you like it. I am
always fiddling and have done
it so many times, I know exactly
what to do. I will start you at
the sweeter spot. I promise.

Again, let me know. I will be
glad to help. I will get you
the cut boards, if you feel
you want them. We'll check
them, right off, if you buy
the pedal new or used.

I just want you to know the
details of working the settings.

Regards,

Pete,

Two questions: 1- Why would any merchant let me take one of their pedals out to try without buying it?

2- Are the pedals now at the stores going to have the problems that you've been having with yours or will this be an updated improved version?

You would try the pedal, there,
at the store of your choice. I will
tell you everything to do to the
pedal. They are clueless.

I will write everything down for
you, giving you step by step in-
structions on exactly what to do
to the pedals. I have it down to
a science.

The pedals, at the stores, will
likely have the old foot-boards.
It will not be a major factor, if
they are cracked or not. What
I want for you is to get the ex-
perience of working it. It is a
really different animal.

But it's radical.



I am sure you can get the new
boards from them, if the ones
you buy are cracked. I am talk-
ing about the cut ones, now.

The Locktite and working the
cam to the best setting are bigger
issues and we'll get past that, at
the store. I promise.

Soon, I hope to post more pics,
here, on the changes and how
the issues were addressed.


Regards,

Regards,

The adjustment that I am talking
about is in the Beater Hub. You
can actually shift the whole beater
forward to backward and the pos-
ition, in combination, with the other
features (Link Receiver, Sliding Toe-
Clamp etc.) makes for a different
action, which might be helpful.

Regards,

I have been in communication
with Bob Gatzen and the pedal
is being re-designed and to be
re-introduced in 2011. I am
very anxious to see what is
done to it and hope to have
word on it for you.

Incidentally, I am still using the
pedals every week.

Regards,

Tama's Speedcobra Pedal







Hi Pete,

Just thought I share this bit of information on Tama's new pedal. Being that your presentation shows the disadvantage of a tension spring, Tama may have resolved if not minimized that issue in pedals. The only real reason for the continued spring with Tama is that it's convenience of clipping on/of of the drive shaft when setting up and storing away.

What's most noted in conceptual theory is inside that clip where the spring attaches to the main drive shaft is a "high quality ball" that gives a smoother, faster and powerful movement. According to the engineering departmnet is that the feel of the pedal playing in different speeds and volume is much more subtle to the touch and having more control for the dynamic drummer.

I don't know, but just thought you might want to check it out if you've hav'nt already. For further investigation log on site below. And of course, thank you for your input on equipment.

http://www.tamadrum.co.jp/speedcobra/features.html

rac

This looks cool. I do, however, think
that the Iron Cobra needs more refine-
ment to compete with the other pedals
on the market, right now, especially
as it relates to the cam.

Thanks, Rac!!

Regards,

You Know, Pete,

I've come to the conclusion that there's a bottom line with all these pedals. And that line is how they respond, feel and.
how well they hold up. With all it's simplicities, the Iron Cobra responds, feels and holds up nicely. All the bells and whistles
make a whole other story. But dollar for dollar, it's among the best pedals out there where the beater meets the bass drum.

D. Slam wrote:You Know, Pete,

I've come to the conclusion that there's a bottom line with all these pedals. And that line is how they respond, feel and.
How well they hold up. With all it's simplicities, the Iron Cobra responds, feels and holds up nicely. All the bells and whistles
make a whole other story. But dollar for dollar, it's among the best pedals out there where the beater meets the bass drum.

Dollar for dollar, it is, Don.
I agree. They also wear
very well.

As an example, while that
is true, I would buy an old
Eliminator, before I would
buy the Iron Cobra, which
is priced around the same
area. The reason would be
the interchangeable cams.

This new feature looks like
and improvement but not
in the area where I think
it most needs it. My view.

Regards,

I feel you, Papa P.

What I am secretly hoping for
is that Bob and Rich (at DW)
have realized that a longer
board (which can be thicker,
due to the lengthening and
still be flexible enough) is the
answer for the Boa, which I
believe STILL has the most
adjustable universal cam
out there. I am hopeful. I
will let you know as soon
as I know more about it.

Regards,