Roach

D. Slam wrote:See what I mean?!

Good to have you back, Uncle... just like old times.

Okay - in one respect I do see. In an another frame of reference, I don't see... and probably never will - simply because I'm not YOU!

D. Slam wrote:Wow... It ain't all that, uncle John... All this "let it go" and "defusing."
I was only commenting on the Max clip and somehow it got into all this!
It's how you see things I guess... If the spark plugs are bad then just
change the whole darn engine... What can I say? If that's the need
you see, then go ahead and fill it my brothah.

First of all, “diffusing, (as I wrote it) does not denote anything near the same concept or action as “defusing,” and was read.

What can “I” say now for you reading one thing when the vocabulary was there to convey the proper thought? The sad part about the discrepancy is that too many want to sleep on the wall than stand on the watch. Too many want to inherit the benefits rather than protecting the privilege.

And yes, I was often criticized for being the spiritual component among many here... you in particular. But then, I can’t quote anything from the old websites… no more than any should want to live on yesterday’s Bread or manna.

D. Slam wrote:Right on the money, Pete... I was only making an observation of a quick moment in time, relatively speaking. Somehow, that got pushed into a whole other realm... Oh well, no biggie. it seems to be the way we roll here on occasion.

Hey, I guess that’s why most want milk from a mother’s teat than live on meat providing growth and sustenance. This is not necessarily a good thing, because I love “milk” too – the “curds” make cheese: a real comfort food that I think many enjoy and can eat without being allergic to the lactic acid. The whey is something totally different altogether… and none of us choose to be Little Miss Muffet when the spider sat down beside her and she/he or us become frightened.

Little Miss Muffet
Sat on a tuffet,
Eating her curds and whey.
Along came a spider,
And sat down beside her,
And frightened Miss Muffet away.

D. Slam wrote: … If that's the need you see, then go ahead and fill it my brothah.

What other “need is there my Brother? I'm not one to be lulled by a lullaby. In this nursery rhyme, the spider is the enemy, while Miss Muffet is the "child. It's an analogy meant to get our minds into action. We’re ALL (being called by some name or another) supposed to fill one need or another. Instead, messengers are being killed (or coerced into silence) even in the 21st Century. Now that’s the DAMed (walled) Shame in the face of a Living God. [… in context: Titus 2:15].

Perhaps those who claim a faith and don’t laud it abroad should be the ones who are already sleeping. The Day is nearly here when He will spit the lukewarm out of His mouth.

Yet the prophecy is true:

* MAT 24:36 But of that day and hour
knoweth no man, no, not the angels of
heaven, but my Father only.
* MAT 24:37 But as the days of Noe
were, so shall also the coming of the
Son of man be.
* MAT 24:38 For as in the days that
were before the flood they were eating
and drinking, marrying and giving in
marriage, until the day that Noe
entered into the ark,
* MAT 24:39 And knew not until the
flood came, and took them all away; so
shall also the coming of the Son of
man be.
MAT 24:40 Then shall two be in the
field; the one shall be taken, and the
other left.

It all comes down and under what "authority" we give credit and plausibility to the lives we live with skin.

See what I mean to share? I do that in more than just music.

Keep stickin.’ Ultimately, some can (or will) take from Buddy R. what Max R. didn't want to express... and visa versa. Like food, it's all a matter of appetite - and not taste alone.

This is an interesting thread.
interesting how quickly max roach went to max vs buddy and back.
funny thing is when i look at clips of buddy they don't seem so amazing to me anymore. Yes he was tops in that arena. That arena just doesn't interest me since i've gone on to explore music and rhythm in their cultural contexts. it makes all these drum solos obsolete, interesting to other swiss rudiment style drummers but boring to dancers. The stuff max did sounded african and moved me more than buddy's amazing style. I have a much greater interest in musical conversations or interplay, the way the drums play off of each other and create feelings in the body. or to put it simply something i call the "funky" aspect. That was in max's solos and i didn't feel that from buddy.

as far as little miss muffet calling us to action I'll leave that to others.

I like lullabies. peace out

kenny wrote: This is an interesting thread.
interesting how quickly max roach went to max vs buddy and back.
funny thing is when i look at clips of buddy they don't seem so amazing to me anymore. Yes he was tops in that arena. That arena just doesn't interest me since i've gone on to explore music and rhythm in their cultural contexts. it makes all these drum solos obsolete, interesting to other swiss rudiment style drummers but boring to dancers. The stuff max did sounded african and moved me more than buddy's amazing style. I have a much greater interest in musical conversations or interplay, the way the drums play off of each other and create feelings in the body. or to put it simply something i call the "funky" aspect. That was in max's solos and i didn't feel that from buddy.

as far as little miss muffet calling us to action I'll leave that to others.

I like lullabies. peace out

I hear you Kenny. And I too understand how when there's a "battle" of drummers, it takes a drummer to follow the subtleties. The average person in the audience can only "try" and follow the rudimental intracacies of rhythm beyond the melody in how the rhythm presents itself. As drummers, our role is to support the music, unless we have ulterior motive involved that obscures the MUSIC and makes us "obtuse" as time keepers.

What I really liked was that you acknowledge the roots of the "drum(s)," and that these days in the 21st Century our likes and dislikes find their beginnings in what we prefer as musicians. In that artery (and not vein), I agree: THIS IS A VERY INTERESTING THREAD. I'd rather it be interesting from the perspective of reconciling our influences with one another TODAY than ignoring the history for others to make the same mistake. What I love about your contribution to this thread is that our likes or dislikes doesn't mean a doggone thing without a musician's ability to convey the various genres or idioms. Just be prepared, is what I say - and God knows that I had to be coming from NYC.

Take Billy/Boomer for example (and I don't mean to be presumptuous here): Billy came on the scene in a time ripe for his injection of uniqueness. Then so many drummers back in 1970-71 were into the group "Dreams." At the SAME TIME, John M. of Mahavishnu Orchestra was already doing what they did. Well before both of these groups, Billy had worked with Horace Silver... then came Miles Davis of "Bitches Brew!" What does that say to you or anyone?...

... My point is that we MUST embrace every genre and idiom to express "musicianship" beyond our likes and dislikes. Yet I suspect I'll be accused of "rambling" again. God forbid. I'm not rambling - I'm only understanding where our influences come from and embracing the same in the artery (not vein) of the MUSIC. Conversely, it is selfish to say that I like this and don't like that when it is all in somebody's shadow. I like it ALL and take what I can glean from the sacrifice than spit out what should be considered.

Finally, you state:

kenny wrote: ... I have a much greater interest in musical conversations or interplay, the way the drums play off of each other and create feelings in the body. or to put it simply something i call the "funky" aspect. That was in max's solos and i didn't feel that from buddy.

as far as little miss muffet calling us to action I'll leave that to others.

I like lullabies. peace out

I hear you there also... both Buddy Rich and Max Roach do something for me. As far as Little Miss Muffet becoming afraid at the spider is concerned? Well, she became afraid. Too many are today - while claiming they make a stand for their convictions as a matter of free will alone. I just hope we have a ground to stand on when everything is reconciled. And it shall be Reconciled at some point or another. We're all walking in each other's shadow. Rather than leave it to another to say, I (and so many others) are already saying it and DOING it... with our own personalities among genres, idioms, personalities, nationalities or political systems worldwide.

... just get out of the house... get out of the Country even; and visit someplace or somewhere foreign; yet so welcoming when all you want to eat is Kentucky Fried Chicken or something "familiar." All one needs is the willingness. The funds will come when the "heart" is there to be a good steward toward the effort. The appetite for something different will appease yourself when the walls are broken down by too many's stubborness and hard assness too many oppose against themselves.

http://www.johnsussewell.com/Shadow-CobhamKofi.mp3

Respectfully to Everyone, with Understanding and hopefully some level (or quantum leap) of wisdom and intimate Knowledge.

I appreciate your comment Kenny in this thread of discussion. That's all I hope we're doing here and influencing each other for positive results and eternal/everlasting fruit/results. Without confusing the issue (for some), I'm very specific in my analysis, while appearing "rambling" to others (as if what is said means anything when they themselves had an opportunity to travel and chose NOT TO. I'm not a hard-ass - just a choice cut making the Cut.

http://www.johnsussewell.com/Winning-NancyStoneWithSuss&AudioHipster-2003.mp3

... as Captain Kirk (William Shatner) and Captain Picard (Patrick Stewart) portrayed as actors: "Make It So!"

In contrast with what I'm offering here and now, is the "response" with an "answer" when no question was ever posed by me or anyone else. We're only expressing our view of things and relationships. I value relationship more than my views. I am only learning by the exchange of ideas in this war of idealogies.

As the British say, "Leave it out" with wars and imperialistic behavior. I'm astute enough to know the difference without being Santa Claus - a lie from the very inception.

I'm not the Giver of Gifts (or talents). I'm just a conveyer (purveyor) to anyone. Don't kill the messenger... hmmm. No wonder too many folks are inept in the face of Evidence:

http://www.johnsussewell.com/Redeemer-withMySonInLoveDavid&MyDaughterAngela-2006.mp3

[... on 7th thought, I rejoice that God has hidden this truth from those who think they are wise, yet know nothing. It requires a personal investment in the Process.]

I believe Billy said BR was a "musical genius." Of course, he was musical as well as having ferocious technique. He was devastating with just one fill. But I agree with kenny and aspire more to be like Max and getting nowhere fast just thinking about it.

kenny wrote: This is an interesting thread.
interesting how quickly max roach went to max vs buddy and back.
funny thing is when i look at clips of buddy they don't seem so amazing to me anymore. Yes he was tops in that arena. That arena just doesn't interest me since i've gone on to explore music and rhythm in their cultural contexts. it makes all these drum solos obsolete, interesting to other swiss rudiment style drummers but boring to dancers. The stuff max did sounded african and moved me more than buddy's amazing style. I have a much greater interest in musical conversations or interplay, the way the drums play off of each other and create feelings in the body. or to put it simply something i call the "funky" aspect. That was in max's solos and i didn't feel that from buddy.

as far as little miss muffet calling us to action I'll leave that to others.

Kenny, you're a music maker... What you say makes perfect sense
and I can fully respect it.

As to the nursery rhyme? I ain't hip to it... But I'm not a Harvard grad
either... So there you go...

I believe Billy said BR was a "musical genius." Of course, he was musical as well as having ferocious technique. He was devastating with just one fill. But I agree with kenny and aspire more to be like Max and getting nowhere fast just thinking about it.

I believe you're right about the quote, Woof.... Here's the good thing.
We don't have to choose one or the other... We can have the best of
both worlds... The heart felt emotion and mental awareness, with the
technical ability to express them.

I love all of your opinions as well as the drummers you mentioned. As we know, Boomer has hit the legendary drummers list just as well respectfully. You'll find this clip on my "Time Machine of Great Drummers."
But I think the course has already been set...sit back and take a listen/watch this classic clip.

https://youtu.be/DYBTBv_h4CQ

Racman wrote:I love all of your opinions as well as the drummers you mentioned. As we know, Boomer has hit the legendary drummers list just as well respectfully. You'll find this clip on my "Time Machine of Great Drummers."
But I think the course has already been set...sit back and take a listen/watch this classic clip.

https://youtu.be/DYBTBv_h4CQ



OH YEAH! Billy/Boomer was no less ferocious when playing with "Dreams" as he had in later years with Herbie. Whereas Gregg Dissionette has a grimace on his face when performing, Billy displays a relaxed state with even more technical ability. Even at points the two (Herbie and Billy) display their confidence with what they are doing...

... yet the sweat is STILL there; especially under "hot" lights with "shirt & tie" on.

I LOVE THIS stuff! Obviously I've paid attention to some while seeminly marginalizing others.

Thanks Glenn!

You're welcome unc Suss and I knew you would enjoy it.

rac